Why light coming from distant stars is not discrete? Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern) 2019 Moderator Election Q&A - Question CollectionPhotons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?How “wide” is a beam of light? What is its half-diameter?Questions About The Delayed Choice Quantum Eraser ExperimentWhy do we see discrete light spikes coming out from a light source?Why can I see a beam of light coming in through the window sometimes, but not all the time?What's the origin of the four rays that come out of the reflection of candlelight in our TV?Does law of inertia has anything to do with speed of light?Gaps between adjacent light rays from a light sourceDiffraction from the Earths edgeIs light a discrete or continuous phenomena?Why does the Sun appear more round while distant stars can appear more pointed?
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Why light coming from distant stars is not discrete?
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)
2019 Moderator Election Q&A - Question CollectionPhotons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?How “wide” is a beam of light? What is its half-diameter?Questions About The Delayed Choice Quantum Eraser ExperimentWhy do we see discrete light spikes coming out from a light source?Why can I see a beam of light coming in through the window sometimes, but not all the time?What's the origin of the four rays that come out of the reflection of candlelight in our TV?Does law of inertia has anything to do with speed of light?Gaps between adjacent light rays from a light sourceDiffraction from the Earths edgeIs light a discrete or continuous phenomena?Why does the Sun appear more round while distant stars can appear more pointed?
$begingroup$
Imaging the light racing out from distant sun, as beam of light shoots aways is a circular pattern (spherical actually), remembering that, light comes in photons or packets of energy.
so how come is that we do not see "gaps" in the light coming from distant stars as these "rays" should have gaps that are getting farther apart as distance grows
visible-light photons stars vision discrete
New contributor
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Imaging the light racing out from distant sun, as beam of light shoots aways is a circular pattern (spherical actually), remembering that, light comes in photons or packets of energy.
so how come is that we do not see "gaps" in the light coming from distant stars as these "rays" should have gaps that are getting farther apart as distance grows
visible-light photons stars vision discrete
New contributor
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Do you see any "gaps" in the light for an ordinary light bulb?
$endgroup$
– my2cts
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
@my2cts I would assume the OP is asking about very far distances and is coming from the point of view that the area that light could reach is not showered by a continuous distribution of photons
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Possible duplicate of Photons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?
$endgroup$
– Harry Johnston
4 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Imaging the light racing out from distant sun, as beam of light shoots aways is a circular pattern (spherical actually), remembering that, light comes in photons or packets of energy.
so how come is that we do not see "gaps" in the light coming from distant stars as these "rays" should have gaps that are getting farther apart as distance grows
visible-light photons stars vision discrete
New contributor
$endgroup$
Imaging the light racing out from distant sun, as beam of light shoots aways is a circular pattern (spherical actually), remembering that, light comes in photons or packets of energy.
so how come is that we do not see "gaps" in the light coming from distant stars as these "rays" should have gaps that are getting farther apart as distance grows
visible-light photons stars vision discrete
visible-light photons stars vision discrete
New contributor
New contributor
edited 1 hour ago
ZeroTheHero
21.3k53364
21.3k53364
New contributor
asked 10 hours ago
benchukbenchuk
1312
1312
New contributor
New contributor
$begingroup$
Do you see any "gaps" in the light for an ordinary light bulb?
$endgroup$
– my2cts
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
@my2cts I would assume the OP is asking about very far distances and is coming from the point of view that the area that light could reach is not showered by a continuous distribution of photons
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Possible duplicate of Photons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?
$endgroup$
– Harry Johnston
4 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Do you see any "gaps" in the light for an ordinary light bulb?
$endgroup$
– my2cts
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
@my2cts I would assume the OP is asking about very far distances and is coming from the point of view that the area that light could reach is not showered by a continuous distribution of photons
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Possible duplicate of Photons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?
$endgroup$
– Harry Johnston
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Do you see any "gaps" in the light for an ordinary light bulb?
$endgroup$
– my2cts
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
Do you see any "gaps" in the light for an ordinary light bulb?
$endgroup$
– my2cts
10 hours ago
2
2
$begingroup$
@my2cts I would assume the OP is asking about very far distances and is coming from the point of view that the area that light could reach is not showered by a continuous distribution of photons
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
@my2cts I would assume the OP is asking about very far distances and is coming from the point of view that the area that light could reach is not showered by a continuous distribution of photons
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
10 hours ago
2
2
$begingroup$
Possible duplicate of Photons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?
$endgroup$
– Harry Johnston
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
Possible duplicate of Photons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?
$endgroup$
– Harry Johnston
4 hours ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
You are right that single photon detection is a discrete event. But you are under the false assumption that these "rays" are discretely distributed.
Ideally, a photon would have an equal probability of being emitted through any solid angle out of the star. i.e. it is a uniform probability distribution with respect to the solid angle. There aren't single rays that are evenly distributed around the star that the photons travel along.
For a water analogy, it is not like the star is a spherical shower head where photons can only be released from discrete locations. So, even if you might have a different random distribution of photon detection events at different angular locations relative to the star, you will still always see photons (this is neglecting stars that are so far away from us that their light never reaches us due to the expanding universe).
Of course, if you are far enough away you will experience fewer and fewer photons. However this is not limited to certain "rays". This will be true at any angle at a large enough distance.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
4
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Very good question. Here is a more QM explanation. It is almost the same as if you would (only for your case) take the Sun as an atom, that is surrounded by an electron field as per QM.
Now the wavefunction of the electron describes the probability distribution of the electron being at a certain position in space around the nucleus.
You would think that the electron can only be at certain discrete number of positions? Well as per QM, the answer is no. In simple words, the electron is at a certain energy level around the nucleus as per QM, but inside that energy level, the electron could be anywhere.
Since the atomic system (and the electron) emits the photons, and the electron could be anywhere (inside the certain energy level as per QM) how would you tell where the electron is at the moment of emission?
So you would imagine that the electron could only take certain fixed positions around the nucleus, and emit the photon from those positions. In reality the electron's position is described by the wavefunction, and it is continuous. Simply said, the electron could be anywhere (inside that certain energy level as per QM).
So in your case if you look at just one single atom, and the atom emits photons from far away, the photons will be continuously distributed. There will be no gaps between the photons.
Now if you look at the Sun, which is made of a whole lot of atoms, you can take it analogously, the photons will be distributed continuously.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
Your Answer
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2 Answers
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oldest
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
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votes
$begingroup$
You are right that single photon detection is a discrete event. But you are under the false assumption that these "rays" are discretely distributed.
Ideally, a photon would have an equal probability of being emitted through any solid angle out of the star. i.e. it is a uniform probability distribution with respect to the solid angle. There aren't single rays that are evenly distributed around the star that the photons travel along.
For a water analogy, it is not like the star is a spherical shower head where photons can only be released from discrete locations. So, even if you might have a different random distribution of photon detection events at different angular locations relative to the star, you will still always see photons (this is neglecting stars that are so far away from us that their light never reaches us due to the expanding universe).
Of course, if you are far enough away you will experience fewer and fewer photons. However this is not limited to certain "rays". This will be true at any angle at a large enough distance.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
4
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are right that single photon detection is a discrete event. But you are under the false assumption that these "rays" are discretely distributed.
Ideally, a photon would have an equal probability of being emitted through any solid angle out of the star. i.e. it is a uniform probability distribution with respect to the solid angle. There aren't single rays that are evenly distributed around the star that the photons travel along.
For a water analogy, it is not like the star is a spherical shower head where photons can only be released from discrete locations. So, even if you might have a different random distribution of photon detection events at different angular locations relative to the star, you will still always see photons (this is neglecting stars that are so far away from us that their light never reaches us due to the expanding universe).
Of course, if you are far enough away you will experience fewer and fewer photons. However this is not limited to certain "rays". This will be true at any angle at a large enough distance.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
4
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are right that single photon detection is a discrete event. But you are under the false assumption that these "rays" are discretely distributed.
Ideally, a photon would have an equal probability of being emitted through any solid angle out of the star. i.e. it is a uniform probability distribution with respect to the solid angle. There aren't single rays that are evenly distributed around the star that the photons travel along.
For a water analogy, it is not like the star is a spherical shower head where photons can only be released from discrete locations. So, even if you might have a different random distribution of photon detection events at different angular locations relative to the star, you will still always see photons (this is neglecting stars that are so far away from us that their light never reaches us due to the expanding universe).
Of course, if you are far enough away you will experience fewer and fewer photons. However this is not limited to certain "rays". This will be true at any angle at a large enough distance.
$endgroup$
You are right that single photon detection is a discrete event. But you are under the false assumption that these "rays" are discretely distributed.
Ideally, a photon would have an equal probability of being emitted through any solid angle out of the star. i.e. it is a uniform probability distribution with respect to the solid angle. There aren't single rays that are evenly distributed around the star that the photons travel along.
For a water analogy, it is not like the star is a spherical shower head where photons can only be released from discrete locations. So, even if you might have a different random distribution of photon detection events at different angular locations relative to the star, you will still always see photons (this is neglecting stars that are so far away from us that their light never reaches us due to the expanding universe).
Of course, if you are far enough away you will experience fewer and fewer photons. However this is not limited to certain "rays". This will be true at any angle at a large enough distance.
edited 9 hours ago
answered 10 hours ago
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.5k42555
15.5k42555
2
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
4
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
add a comment |
2
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
4
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
2
2
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
The question is being asked by somebody who thinks in terms of light rays that are getting farther apart as they go farther from the source, and it is not a wrong way to think about it. So, very few photons going into a vast space ---> big gaps. And indeed photons from a given star arrive very far spaced out, less than one per second into a human eye.
$endgroup$
– Kostas
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Kostas But the sparsity of photons is not due to not being along the correct ray. Nevertheless I have added something to my answer about being far away from a star.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
9 hours ago
4
4
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
The faintest stars we can see deliver 140 photons per second to our eyes.
$endgroup$
– Keith McClary
3 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
@KiethMcClary Thanks for the info :)
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Very good question. Here is a more QM explanation. It is almost the same as if you would (only for your case) take the Sun as an atom, that is surrounded by an electron field as per QM.
Now the wavefunction of the electron describes the probability distribution of the electron being at a certain position in space around the nucleus.
You would think that the electron can only be at certain discrete number of positions? Well as per QM, the answer is no. In simple words, the electron is at a certain energy level around the nucleus as per QM, but inside that energy level, the electron could be anywhere.
Since the atomic system (and the electron) emits the photons, and the electron could be anywhere (inside the certain energy level as per QM) how would you tell where the electron is at the moment of emission?
So you would imagine that the electron could only take certain fixed positions around the nucleus, and emit the photon from those positions. In reality the electron's position is described by the wavefunction, and it is continuous. Simply said, the electron could be anywhere (inside that certain energy level as per QM).
So in your case if you look at just one single atom, and the atom emits photons from far away, the photons will be continuously distributed. There will be no gaps between the photons.
Now if you look at the Sun, which is made of a whole lot of atoms, you can take it analogously, the photons will be distributed continuously.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Very good question. Here is a more QM explanation. It is almost the same as if you would (only for your case) take the Sun as an atom, that is surrounded by an electron field as per QM.
Now the wavefunction of the electron describes the probability distribution of the electron being at a certain position in space around the nucleus.
You would think that the electron can only be at certain discrete number of positions? Well as per QM, the answer is no. In simple words, the electron is at a certain energy level around the nucleus as per QM, but inside that energy level, the electron could be anywhere.
Since the atomic system (and the electron) emits the photons, and the electron could be anywhere (inside the certain energy level as per QM) how would you tell where the electron is at the moment of emission?
So you would imagine that the electron could only take certain fixed positions around the nucleus, and emit the photon from those positions. In reality the electron's position is described by the wavefunction, and it is continuous. Simply said, the electron could be anywhere (inside that certain energy level as per QM).
So in your case if you look at just one single atom, and the atom emits photons from far away, the photons will be continuously distributed. There will be no gaps between the photons.
Now if you look at the Sun, which is made of a whole lot of atoms, you can take it analogously, the photons will be distributed continuously.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Very good question. Here is a more QM explanation. It is almost the same as if you would (only for your case) take the Sun as an atom, that is surrounded by an electron field as per QM.
Now the wavefunction of the electron describes the probability distribution of the electron being at a certain position in space around the nucleus.
You would think that the electron can only be at certain discrete number of positions? Well as per QM, the answer is no. In simple words, the electron is at a certain energy level around the nucleus as per QM, but inside that energy level, the electron could be anywhere.
Since the atomic system (and the electron) emits the photons, and the electron could be anywhere (inside the certain energy level as per QM) how would you tell where the electron is at the moment of emission?
So you would imagine that the electron could only take certain fixed positions around the nucleus, and emit the photon from those positions. In reality the electron's position is described by the wavefunction, and it is continuous. Simply said, the electron could be anywhere (inside that certain energy level as per QM).
So in your case if you look at just one single atom, and the atom emits photons from far away, the photons will be continuously distributed. There will be no gaps between the photons.
Now if you look at the Sun, which is made of a whole lot of atoms, you can take it analogously, the photons will be distributed continuously.
$endgroup$
Very good question. Here is a more QM explanation. It is almost the same as if you would (only for your case) take the Sun as an atom, that is surrounded by an electron field as per QM.
Now the wavefunction of the electron describes the probability distribution of the electron being at a certain position in space around the nucleus.
You would think that the electron can only be at certain discrete number of positions? Well as per QM, the answer is no. In simple words, the electron is at a certain energy level around the nucleus as per QM, but inside that energy level, the electron could be anywhere.
Since the atomic system (and the electron) emits the photons, and the electron could be anywhere (inside the certain energy level as per QM) how would you tell where the electron is at the moment of emission?
So you would imagine that the electron could only take certain fixed positions around the nucleus, and emit the photon from those positions. In reality the electron's position is described by the wavefunction, and it is continuous. Simply said, the electron could be anywhere (inside that certain energy level as per QM).
So in your case if you look at just one single atom, and the atom emits photons from far away, the photons will be continuously distributed. There will be no gaps between the photons.
Now if you look at the Sun, which is made of a whole lot of atoms, you can take it analogously, the photons will be distributed continuously.
answered 9 hours ago
Árpád SzendreiÁrpád Szendrei
4,3021624
4,3021624
add a comment |
add a comment |
benchuk is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
benchuk is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
benchuk is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
benchuk is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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$begingroup$
Do you see any "gaps" in the light for an ordinary light bulb?
$endgroup$
– my2cts
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
@my2cts I would assume the OP is asking about very far distances and is coming from the point of view that the area that light could reach is not showered by a continuous distribution of photons
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
10 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Possible duplicate of Photons from stars--how do they fill in such large angular distances?
$endgroup$
– Harry Johnston
4 hours ago