How can you use ICE tables to solve multiple coupled equilibria?How to calculate the concentration of all relevant species in a buffer of a given pH?Determining equilibrium concentrations from initial conditions and equilibrium constantDetermining solubility of silver sulfate in its saturated solutionIs LiOH a weaker base than NaOH?What's the Kp value?Equilibrium Bond Dissociationice tables equilibirium qConfusion about the ICE tableHow do I find the theoretical pH of a buffer solution after HCl and NaOH were added, separately?Q. 36 2018 molar solubility of CaF2 at pH3 given molar solubility at pH7 and pKa of HF
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How can you use ICE tables to solve multiple coupled equilibria?
How to calculate the concentration of all relevant species in a buffer of a given pH?Determining equilibrium concentrations from initial conditions and equilibrium constantDetermining solubility of silver sulfate in its saturated solutionIs LiOH a weaker base than NaOH?What's the Kp value?Equilibrium Bond Dissociationice tables equilibirium qConfusion about the ICE tableHow do I find the theoretical pH of a buffer solution after HCl and NaOH were added, separately?Q. 36 2018 molar solubility of CaF2 at pH3 given molar solubility at pH7 and pKa of HF
$begingroup$
If I have a problem involving multiple coupled equilibrium reactions, such as
Calcium fluoride, $ceCaF2$, has a molar solubility of $pu2.1e−4 mol L−1$ at pH = 7.00. By what factor does its molar solubility increase in a solution with pH = 3.00? The p$K_mathrma$ of $ceHF$ is 3.17.
The relevant reactions are:
$$ceCaF2(s) <=> Ca^2+(aq) + 2 F-(aq)$$ and
$$ceHF(aq) <=> H+(aq) + F-(aq)$$
They are coupled because fluoride occurs in both of them.
Is there a way to use ICE tables to organize the information (stoichiometry, initial concentrations, mass balance) as a way to solve the problem?
For example, I could try to set up one ICE table for each reaction (the column for $ceH+$ is strange because in the problem, the pH is set to a value through an unspecified mechanism):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x & +2x \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x \
hline
endarray
$$
and
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceHF] & [ceH+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & 0 & textN/A & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x &textN/A & -x \
hline
E & +x & 10^-3.00 & pu4.2e−4 - x\
hline
endarray
$$
However, how do the fluoride concentrations "talk to each other" in the two tables? Is the $x$ in one table the same as the $x$ in the other table?
equilibrium
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If I have a problem involving multiple coupled equilibrium reactions, such as
Calcium fluoride, $ceCaF2$, has a molar solubility of $pu2.1e−4 mol L−1$ at pH = 7.00. By what factor does its molar solubility increase in a solution with pH = 3.00? The p$K_mathrma$ of $ceHF$ is 3.17.
The relevant reactions are:
$$ceCaF2(s) <=> Ca^2+(aq) + 2 F-(aq)$$ and
$$ceHF(aq) <=> H+(aq) + F-(aq)$$
They are coupled because fluoride occurs in both of them.
Is there a way to use ICE tables to organize the information (stoichiometry, initial concentrations, mass balance) as a way to solve the problem?
For example, I could try to set up one ICE table for each reaction (the column for $ceH+$ is strange because in the problem, the pH is set to a value through an unspecified mechanism):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x & +2x \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x \
hline
endarray
$$
and
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceHF] & [ceH+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & 0 & textN/A & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x &textN/A & -x \
hline
E & +x & 10^-3.00 & pu4.2e−4 - x\
hline
endarray
$$
However, how do the fluoride concentrations "talk to each other" in the two tables? Is the $x$ in one table the same as the $x$ in the other table?
equilibrium
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Your "initial state" seems to be pH 7 so you do know the [H+] at the start.
$endgroup$
– Tan Yong Boon
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, but the pH is adjusted externally, so we can't take the change in [H+] to deduce how much [HF] and [F-] are changing. For that reason, I left that box as N/A. I could have left the entire column out instead.
$endgroup$
– Karsten Theis
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If I have a problem involving multiple coupled equilibrium reactions, such as
Calcium fluoride, $ceCaF2$, has a molar solubility of $pu2.1e−4 mol L−1$ at pH = 7.00. By what factor does its molar solubility increase in a solution with pH = 3.00? The p$K_mathrma$ of $ceHF$ is 3.17.
The relevant reactions are:
$$ceCaF2(s) <=> Ca^2+(aq) + 2 F-(aq)$$ and
$$ceHF(aq) <=> H+(aq) + F-(aq)$$
They are coupled because fluoride occurs in both of them.
Is there a way to use ICE tables to organize the information (stoichiometry, initial concentrations, mass balance) as a way to solve the problem?
For example, I could try to set up one ICE table for each reaction (the column for $ceH+$ is strange because in the problem, the pH is set to a value through an unspecified mechanism):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x & +2x \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x \
hline
endarray
$$
and
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceHF] & [ceH+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & 0 & textN/A & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x &textN/A & -x \
hline
E & +x & 10^-3.00 & pu4.2e−4 - x\
hline
endarray
$$
However, how do the fluoride concentrations "talk to each other" in the two tables? Is the $x$ in one table the same as the $x$ in the other table?
equilibrium
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
If I have a problem involving multiple coupled equilibrium reactions, such as
Calcium fluoride, $ceCaF2$, has a molar solubility of $pu2.1e−4 mol L−1$ at pH = 7.00. By what factor does its molar solubility increase in a solution with pH = 3.00? The p$K_mathrma$ of $ceHF$ is 3.17.
The relevant reactions are:
$$ceCaF2(s) <=> Ca^2+(aq) + 2 F-(aq)$$ and
$$ceHF(aq) <=> H+(aq) + F-(aq)$$
They are coupled because fluoride occurs in both of them.
Is there a way to use ICE tables to organize the information (stoichiometry, initial concentrations, mass balance) as a way to solve the problem?
For example, I could try to set up one ICE table for each reaction (the column for $ceH+$ is strange because in the problem, the pH is set to a value through an unspecified mechanism):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x & +2x \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x \
hline
endarray
$$
and
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceHF] & [ceH+] & [ceF-] \
hline
I & 0 & textN/A & pu4.2e−4 \
hline
C & +x &textN/A & -x \
hline
E & +x & 10^-3.00 & pu4.2e−4 - x\
hline
endarray
$$
However, how do the fluoride concentrations "talk to each other" in the two tables? Is the $x$ in one table the same as the $x$ in the other table?
equilibrium
equilibrium
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
3,870318
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
asked 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
2,705434
$begingroup$
Your "initial state" seems to be pH 7 so you do know the [H+] at the start.
$endgroup$
– Tan Yong Boon
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, but the pH is adjusted externally, so we can't take the change in [H+] to deduce how much [HF] and [F-] are changing. For that reason, I left that box as N/A. I could have left the entire column out instead.
$endgroup$
– Karsten Theis
2 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Your "initial state" seems to be pH 7 so you do know the [H+] at the start.
$endgroup$
– Tan Yong Boon
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, but the pH is adjusted externally, so we can't take the change in [H+] to deduce how much [HF] and [F-] are changing. For that reason, I left that box as N/A. I could have left the entire column out instead.
$endgroup$
– Karsten Theis
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Your "initial state" seems to be pH 7 so you do know the [H+] at the start.
$endgroup$
– Tan Yong Boon
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Your "initial state" seems to be pH 7 so you do know the [H+] at the start.
$endgroup$
– Tan Yong Boon
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, but the pH is adjusted externally, so we can't take the change in [H+] to deduce how much [HF] and [F-] are changing. For that reason, I left that box as N/A. I could have left the entire column out instead.
$endgroup$
– Karsten Theis
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, but the pH is adjusted externally, so we can't take the change in [H+] to deduce how much [HF] and [F-] are changing. For that reason, I left that box as N/A. I could have left the entire column out instead.
$endgroup$
– Karsten Theis
2 hours ago
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The way to use ICE tables in this case would be to combine the ICE tables, and use "$x$" for the changes due to one reaction and "$y$" for the changes due to the other. For each reaction, you have one unknown (how far it reacted, i.e. $x$ and $y$), so you need two pieces of information to solve it, in this case the two equilibrium constants.
Here is the combined ICE table:
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +x & +2x-y & textN/A & +y \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x-y & 10^-3.00 & +y \
hline
endarray
$$
Now, you can use the equilibrium constants for the two reactions to solve for $x$ and $y$, giving you the equilibrium concentrations.
What the combined table shows is that the fluoride concentration depends on both reactions, so you can't first deal with one equilibrium and then with the other but have to solve a system of two equations with two unknowns.
Once you combine the tables, you could also have initial conditions where nothing is dissolved yet, to get easier expressions (I'm using $p$ and $q$ because they will be different from $x$ and $y$):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & 0 & 0 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +p & +2p-q & textN/A & +q \
hline
E & +p & +2p-q & 10^-3.00 & +q \
hline
endarray
$$
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
add a comment |
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1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The way to use ICE tables in this case would be to combine the ICE tables, and use "$x$" for the changes due to one reaction and "$y$" for the changes due to the other. For each reaction, you have one unknown (how far it reacted, i.e. $x$ and $y$), so you need two pieces of information to solve it, in this case the two equilibrium constants.
Here is the combined ICE table:
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +x & +2x-y & textN/A & +y \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x-y & 10^-3.00 & +y \
hline
endarray
$$
Now, you can use the equilibrium constants for the two reactions to solve for $x$ and $y$, giving you the equilibrium concentrations.
What the combined table shows is that the fluoride concentration depends on both reactions, so you can't first deal with one equilibrium and then with the other but have to solve a system of two equations with two unknowns.
Once you combine the tables, you could also have initial conditions where nothing is dissolved yet, to get easier expressions (I'm using $p$ and $q$ because they will be different from $x$ and $y$):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & 0 & 0 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +p & +2p-q & textN/A & +q \
hline
E & +p & +2p-q & 10^-3.00 & +q \
hline
endarray
$$
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The way to use ICE tables in this case would be to combine the ICE tables, and use "$x$" for the changes due to one reaction and "$y$" for the changes due to the other. For each reaction, you have one unknown (how far it reacted, i.e. $x$ and $y$), so you need two pieces of information to solve it, in this case the two equilibrium constants.
Here is the combined ICE table:
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +x & +2x-y & textN/A & +y \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x-y & 10^-3.00 & +y \
hline
endarray
$$
Now, you can use the equilibrium constants for the two reactions to solve for $x$ and $y$, giving you the equilibrium concentrations.
What the combined table shows is that the fluoride concentration depends on both reactions, so you can't first deal with one equilibrium and then with the other but have to solve a system of two equations with two unknowns.
Once you combine the tables, you could also have initial conditions where nothing is dissolved yet, to get easier expressions (I'm using $p$ and $q$ because they will be different from $x$ and $y$):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & 0 & 0 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +p & +2p-q & textN/A & +q \
hline
E & +p & +2p-q & 10^-3.00 & +q \
hline
endarray
$$
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The way to use ICE tables in this case would be to combine the ICE tables, and use "$x$" for the changes due to one reaction and "$y$" for the changes due to the other. For each reaction, you have one unknown (how far it reacted, i.e. $x$ and $y$), so you need two pieces of information to solve it, in this case the two equilibrium constants.
Here is the combined ICE table:
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +x & +2x-y & textN/A & +y \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x-y & 10^-3.00 & +y \
hline
endarray
$$
Now, you can use the equilibrium constants for the two reactions to solve for $x$ and $y$, giving you the equilibrium concentrations.
What the combined table shows is that the fluoride concentration depends on both reactions, so you can't first deal with one equilibrium and then with the other but have to solve a system of two equations with two unknowns.
Once you combine the tables, you could also have initial conditions where nothing is dissolved yet, to get easier expressions (I'm using $p$ and $q$ because they will be different from $x$ and $y$):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & 0 & 0 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +p & +2p-q & textN/A & +q \
hline
E & +p & +2p-q & 10^-3.00 & +q \
hline
endarray
$$
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
$endgroup$
The way to use ICE tables in this case would be to combine the ICE tables, and use "$x$" for the changes due to one reaction and "$y$" for the changes due to the other. For each reaction, you have one unknown (how far it reacted, i.e. $x$ and $y$), so you need two pieces of information to solve it, in this case the two equilibrium constants.
Here is the combined ICE table:
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & pu2.1e−4 & pu4.2e−4 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +x & +2x-y & textN/A & +y \
hline
E & pu2.1e−4+x & pu4.2e−4+2x-y & 10^-3.00 & +y \
hline
endarray
$$
Now, you can use the equilibrium constants for the two reactions to solve for $x$ and $y$, giving you the equilibrium concentrations.
What the combined table shows is that the fluoride concentration depends on both reactions, so you can't first deal with one equilibrium and then with the other but have to solve a system of two equations with two unknowns.
Once you combine the tables, you could also have initial conditions where nothing is dissolved yet, to get easier expressions (I'm using $p$ and $q$ because they will be different from $x$ and $y$):
$$
beginarray
hline
&[ceCa^2+] & [ceF-] & [ceH+]&[ceHF] \
hline
I & 0 & 0 & textN/A & 0 \
hline
C & +p & +2p-q & textN/A & +q \
hline
E & +p & +2p-q & 10^-3.00 & +q \
hline
endarray
$$
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
edited 6 hours ago
Mathew Mahindaratne
3,870318
3,870318
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
answered 8 hours ago
Karsten TheisKarsten Theis
2,705434
2,705434
add a comment |
add a comment |
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$begingroup$
Your "initial state" seems to be pH 7 so you do know the [H+] at the start.
$endgroup$
– Tan Yong Boon
2 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, but the pH is adjusted externally, so we can't take the change in [H+] to deduce how much [HF] and [F-] are changing. For that reason, I left that box as N/A. I could have left the entire column out instead.
$endgroup$
– Karsten Theis
2 hours ago