Wolves and sheep The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are In Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)Fastest way to collect an arbitrary armyMiddle weight puzzleA puzzle of trust and lies, allies and spiesCooperative guessing against an evil godLabeling wires in a *damaged* bundleMonopoly Game Show: Is there a winning strategy?Picking A Number GamePrisoners and minority votingMove 10 sheep on another shoreBlindfold Bingo

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Wolves and sheep



The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are In
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)Fastest way to collect an arbitrary armyMiddle weight puzzleA puzzle of trust and lies, allies and spiesCooperative guessing against an evil godLabeling wires in a *damaged* bundleMonopoly Game Show: Is there a winning strategy?Picking A Number GamePrisoners and minority votingMove 10 sheep on another shoreBlindfold Bingo










5












$begingroup$


All the sheep were living peacefully in the Land of Shewo. But suddenly they were struck by a danger. A few wolves dressed up as sheep entered the territory of Shewo and started killing the sheep one by one.



To find a solution to this misery, the king of Shewo called upon all of his sheep to the palace hall. He made the following announcement:




From my secret sources, I came to know that the total number of 'sheep' (including the wolves) now present in my kingdom is 100. Among which 5 are wolves. Our doctors have come up with a very expensive blood test which could be used to differentiate the wolves and sheep.



Each test costs 1000$ and we don't have enough funds to test all the 100 'sheep'.



I discussed with our ministers and came to know that the tests can be done on pooled bloodsamples. i.e., I can collect bloods from any number of 'sheep' and mix them. Then if I test the mixture, I will get a positive result if the mixture contain blood from any wolf. I will get a negative result if all the samples are from actual sheep.




One caveat is that the test results are available to you after all the tests are done!




Now , I am looking for ideas where I can find ALL the wolves in minimum number of pooled tests. I request the brilliant young minds of this land to come up with a testing strategy.




Can you help the king by devising a strategy?










share|improve this question









$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    This is close to a covering design (Lotto wheel) problem.
    $endgroup$
    – Arnaud Mortier
    3 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    First of all, does the government have enough funds to test 99 of the sheep? Because that would work, at a cost of $99,000. Congrats, you just saved 1,000 bucks.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    55 mins ago











  • $begingroup$
    Alternatively, you know the location of all 5 wolves. Take initiative and slaughter all 100. Now you have no more wolves, and food for a good while to come.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    43 mins ago















5












$begingroup$


All the sheep were living peacefully in the Land of Shewo. But suddenly they were struck by a danger. A few wolves dressed up as sheep entered the territory of Shewo and started killing the sheep one by one.



To find a solution to this misery, the king of Shewo called upon all of his sheep to the palace hall. He made the following announcement:




From my secret sources, I came to know that the total number of 'sheep' (including the wolves) now present in my kingdom is 100. Among which 5 are wolves. Our doctors have come up with a very expensive blood test which could be used to differentiate the wolves and sheep.



Each test costs 1000$ and we don't have enough funds to test all the 100 'sheep'.



I discussed with our ministers and came to know that the tests can be done on pooled bloodsamples. i.e., I can collect bloods from any number of 'sheep' and mix them. Then if I test the mixture, I will get a positive result if the mixture contain blood from any wolf. I will get a negative result if all the samples are from actual sheep.




One caveat is that the test results are available to you after all the tests are done!




Now , I am looking for ideas where I can find ALL the wolves in minimum number of pooled tests. I request the brilliant young minds of this land to come up with a testing strategy.




Can you help the king by devising a strategy?










share|improve this question









$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    This is close to a covering design (Lotto wheel) problem.
    $endgroup$
    – Arnaud Mortier
    3 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    First of all, does the government have enough funds to test 99 of the sheep? Because that would work, at a cost of $99,000. Congrats, you just saved 1,000 bucks.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    55 mins ago











  • $begingroup$
    Alternatively, you know the location of all 5 wolves. Take initiative and slaughter all 100. Now you have no more wolves, and food for a good while to come.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    43 mins ago













5












5








5





$begingroup$


All the sheep were living peacefully in the Land of Shewo. But suddenly they were struck by a danger. A few wolves dressed up as sheep entered the territory of Shewo and started killing the sheep one by one.



To find a solution to this misery, the king of Shewo called upon all of his sheep to the palace hall. He made the following announcement:




From my secret sources, I came to know that the total number of 'sheep' (including the wolves) now present in my kingdom is 100. Among which 5 are wolves. Our doctors have come up with a very expensive blood test which could be used to differentiate the wolves and sheep.



Each test costs 1000$ and we don't have enough funds to test all the 100 'sheep'.



I discussed with our ministers and came to know that the tests can be done on pooled bloodsamples. i.e., I can collect bloods from any number of 'sheep' and mix them. Then if I test the mixture, I will get a positive result if the mixture contain blood from any wolf. I will get a negative result if all the samples are from actual sheep.




One caveat is that the test results are available to you after all the tests are done!




Now , I am looking for ideas where I can find ALL the wolves in minimum number of pooled tests. I request the brilliant young minds of this land to come up with a testing strategy.




Can you help the king by devising a strategy?










share|improve this question









$endgroup$




All the sheep were living peacefully in the Land of Shewo. But suddenly they were struck by a danger. A few wolves dressed up as sheep entered the territory of Shewo and started killing the sheep one by one.



To find a solution to this misery, the king of Shewo called upon all of his sheep to the palace hall. He made the following announcement:




From my secret sources, I came to know that the total number of 'sheep' (including the wolves) now present in my kingdom is 100. Among which 5 are wolves. Our doctors have come up with a very expensive blood test which could be used to differentiate the wolves and sheep.



Each test costs 1000$ and we don't have enough funds to test all the 100 'sheep'.



I discussed with our ministers and came to know that the tests can be done on pooled bloodsamples. i.e., I can collect bloods from any number of 'sheep' and mix them. Then if I test the mixture, I will get a positive result if the mixture contain blood from any wolf. I will get a negative result if all the samples are from actual sheep.




One caveat is that the test results are available to you after all the tests are done!




Now , I am looking for ideas where I can find ALL the wolves in minimum number of pooled tests. I request the brilliant young minds of this land to come up with a testing strategy.




Can you help the king by devising a strategy?







strategy combinatorics algorithm






share|improve this question













share|improve this question











share|improve this question




share|improve this question










asked 3 hours ago









Jyotish RobinJyotish Robin

515112




515112











  • $begingroup$
    This is close to a covering design (Lotto wheel) problem.
    $endgroup$
    – Arnaud Mortier
    3 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    First of all, does the government have enough funds to test 99 of the sheep? Because that would work, at a cost of $99,000. Congrats, you just saved 1,000 bucks.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    55 mins ago











  • $begingroup$
    Alternatively, you know the location of all 5 wolves. Take initiative and slaughter all 100. Now you have no more wolves, and food for a good while to come.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    43 mins ago
















  • $begingroup$
    This is close to a covering design (Lotto wheel) problem.
    $endgroup$
    – Arnaud Mortier
    3 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    First of all, does the government have enough funds to test 99 of the sheep? Because that would work, at a cost of $99,000. Congrats, you just saved 1,000 bucks.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    55 mins ago











  • $begingroup$
    Alternatively, you know the location of all 5 wolves. Take initiative and slaughter all 100. Now you have no more wolves, and food for a good while to come.
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    43 mins ago















$begingroup$
This is close to a covering design (Lotto wheel) problem.
$endgroup$
– Arnaud Mortier
3 hours ago




$begingroup$
This is close to a covering design (Lotto wheel) problem.
$endgroup$
– Arnaud Mortier
3 hours ago












$begingroup$
First of all, does the government have enough funds to test 99 of the sheep? Because that would work, at a cost of $99,000. Congrats, you just saved 1,000 bucks.
$endgroup$
– user45266
55 mins ago





$begingroup$
First of all, does the government have enough funds to test 99 of the sheep? Because that would work, at a cost of $99,000. Congrats, you just saved 1,000 bucks.
$endgroup$
– user45266
55 mins ago













$begingroup$
Alternatively, you know the location of all 5 wolves. Take initiative and slaughter all 100. Now you have no more wolves, and food for a good while to come.
$endgroup$
– user45266
43 mins ago




$begingroup$
Alternatively, you know the location of all 5 wolves. Take initiative and slaughter all 100. Now you have no more wolves, and food for a good while to come.
$endgroup$
– user45266
43 mins ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















1












$begingroup$

Here's my shot at it:




Pool 50 of the sheep. Of those 50, if the result comes back positive (wolf detected), split in half again, testing 25 pooled together. If this comes back positive, either 12 or 13 ofthe positive group. You see where this is going. Any negative results rule out all sheep in that group. Worst case scenario, it takes 54 tests (see image for explanation). Best case scenario, you get 14 tests. Price range: 14,000 - 54,000 dollars.




Not sure yet of the expected average, but I know this is better than 99 tests on average.



Diagram:




sheep.jpg




If this isn't the optimal solution, then my best bet on how to improve it would be to:




split into 1/5 the size of each group.







share|improve this answer









$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
    $endgroup$
    – ppgdev
    28 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    26 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    24 mins ago










  • $begingroup$
    I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
    $endgroup$
    – ppgdev
    8 mins ago


















0












$begingroup$

There must be better algorithms, but just to put an upper bound on a solution, the worst case scenario can be reduced to




35 tests. Do binary searches for one wolf. Each search is done on all the sheep minus wolfs found in the previous searches. So the first binary search is done on a set of all 100 'sheep'. You will find a wolf in no more than 7 tests. The next binary search is done on remaining 99 sheep. And so on. You will need 5 binary searches. Each search will take at most 7 tests. So the worst case scenario is 35 tests.






share









$endgroup$













    Your Answer








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    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes








    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    1












    $begingroup$

    Here's my shot at it:




    Pool 50 of the sheep. Of those 50, if the result comes back positive (wolf detected), split in half again, testing 25 pooled together. If this comes back positive, either 12 or 13 ofthe positive group. You see where this is going. Any negative results rule out all sheep in that group. Worst case scenario, it takes 54 tests (see image for explanation). Best case scenario, you get 14 tests. Price range: 14,000 - 54,000 dollars.




    Not sure yet of the expected average, but I know this is better than 99 tests on average.



    Diagram:




    sheep.jpg




    If this isn't the optimal solution, then my best bet on how to improve it would be to:




    split into 1/5 the size of each group.







    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      28 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      26 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      24 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      8 mins ago















    1












    $begingroup$

    Here's my shot at it:




    Pool 50 of the sheep. Of those 50, if the result comes back positive (wolf detected), split in half again, testing 25 pooled together. If this comes back positive, either 12 or 13 ofthe positive group. You see where this is going. Any negative results rule out all sheep in that group. Worst case scenario, it takes 54 tests (see image for explanation). Best case scenario, you get 14 tests. Price range: 14,000 - 54,000 dollars.




    Not sure yet of the expected average, but I know this is better than 99 tests on average.



    Diagram:




    sheep.jpg




    If this isn't the optimal solution, then my best bet on how to improve it would be to:




    split into 1/5 the size of each group.







    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      28 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      26 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      24 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      8 mins ago













    1












    1








    1





    $begingroup$

    Here's my shot at it:




    Pool 50 of the sheep. Of those 50, if the result comes back positive (wolf detected), split in half again, testing 25 pooled together. If this comes back positive, either 12 or 13 ofthe positive group. You see where this is going. Any negative results rule out all sheep in that group. Worst case scenario, it takes 54 tests (see image for explanation). Best case scenario, you get 14 tests. Price range: 14,000 - 54,000 dollars.




    Not sure yet of the expected average, but I know this is better than 99 tests on average.



    Diagram:




    sheep.jpg




    If this isn't the optimal solution, then my best bet on how to improve it would be to:




    split into 1/5 the size of each group.







    share|improve this answer









    $endgroup$



    Here's my shot at it:




    Pool 50 of the sheep. Of those 50, if the result comes back positive (wolf detected), split in half again, testing 25 pooled together. If this comes back positive, either 12 or 13 ofthe positive group. You see where this is going. Any negative results rule out all sheep in that group. Worst case scenario, it takes 54 tests (see image for explanation). Best case scenario, you get 14 tests. Price range: 14,000 - 54,000 dollars.




    Not sure yet of the expected average, but I know this is better than 99 tests on average.



    Diagram:




    sheep.jpg




    If this isn't the optimal solution, then my best bet on how to improve it would be to:




    split into 1/5 the size of each group.








    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered 46 mins ago









    user45266user45266

    32514




    32514











    • $begingroup$
      I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      28 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      26 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      24 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      8 mins ago
















    • $begingroup$
      I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      28 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      26 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
      $endgroup$
      – user45266
      24 mins ago










    • $begingroup$
      I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
      $endgroup$
      – ppgdev
      8 mins ago















    $begingroup$
    I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
    $endgroup$
    – ppgdev
    28 mins ago




    $begingroup$
    I do not consider it much of a spoiler (there must be better algorithms) but the worst case scenario can be easily reduced to 35 tests. rot13(Qb ovanel frnepurf sbe bar jbys. Rnpu frnepu vf qbar ba nyy gur furrc zvahf jbysf sbhaq va gur cerivbhf frnepurf. Lbh jvyy arrq 5 frnepurf. Rnpu frnepu jvyy gnxr ng zbfg 7 grfgf. Fb gur jbefg pnfr fpranevb vf 35 grfgf).
    $endgroup$
    – ppgdev
    28 mins ago












    $begingroup$
    Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    26 mins ago




    $begingroup$
    Wait a minute, how would that work? Could you be a little more specific?
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    26 mins ago












    $begingroup$
    @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    24 mins ago




    $begingroup$
    @ppgdev Like starting with 100, you split the group into 5 groups? What do you mean?
    $endgroup$
    – user45266
    24 mins ago












    $begingroup$
    I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
    $endgroup$
    – ppgdev
    8 mins ago




    $begingroup$
    I moved my comment into an upper bound answer, with a more detailed explanation.
    $endgroup$
    – ppgdev
    8 mins ago











    0












    $begingroup$

    There must be better algorithms, but just to put an upper bound on a solution, the worst case scenario can be reduced to




    35 tests. Do binary searches for one wolf. Each search is done on all the sheep minus wolfs found in the previous searches. So the first binary search is done on a set of all 100 'sheep'. You will find a wolf in no more than 7 tests. The next binary search is done on remaining 99 sheep. And so on. You will need 5 binary searches. Each search will take at most 7 tests. So the worst case scenario is 35 tests.






    share









    $endgroup$

















      0












      $begingroup$

      There must be better algorithms, but just to put an upper bound on a solution, the worst case scenario can be reduced to




      35 tests. Do binary searches for one wolf. Each search is done on all the sheep minus wolfs found in the previous searches. So the first binary search is done on a set of all 100 'sheep'. You will find a wolf in no more than 7 tests. The next binary search is done on remaining 99 sheep. And so on. You will need 5 binary searches. Each search will take at most 7 tests. So the worst case scenario is 35 tests.






      share









      $endgroup$















        0












        0








        0





        $begingroup$

        There must be better algorithms, but just to put an upper bound on a solution, the worst case scenario can be reduced to




        35 tests. Do binary searches for one wolf. Each search is done on all the sheep minus wolfs found in the previous searches. So the first binary search is done on a set of all 100 'sheep'. You will find a wolf in no more than 7 tests. The next binary search is done on remaining 99 sheep. And so on. You will need 5 binary searches. Each search will take at most 7 tests. So the worst case scenario is 35 tests.






        share









        $endgroup$



        There must be better algorithms, but just to put an upper bound on a solution, the worst case scenario can be reduced to




        35 tests. Do binary searches for one wolf. Each search is done on all the sheep minus wolfs found in the previous searches. So the first binary search is done on a set of all 100 'sheep'. You will find a wolf in no more than 7 tests. The next binary search is done on remaining 99 sheep. And so on. You will need 5 binary searches. Each search will take at most 7 tests. So the worst case scenario is 35 tests.







        share











        share


        share










        answered 9 mins ago









        ppgdevppgdev

        41516




        41516



























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